Two Urban Places on Planet Earth

[ablarc]

TWO URBAN PLACES ON PLANET EARTH

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[ablarc]

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[ablarc]

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Zero Sprawl.

[Alonzo-ny]

Gorgeous, where are they? First one looks familiar

[ablarc]

First one looks familiar
To you in particular... it should! ;)

[Alonzo-ny]

I knew it! Its killing me though i cant figure its location?

[ablarc]

^ Fife.

[Alonzo-ny]

I was thinkin there, but which town, google earth doesnt have hi res in fife. Is it pittenweem? If it is did you know the fisherman there have to commute because property prices in the tiny little village are way too high, a product of britains property boom and the towns 'quaintness'

[ablarc]

Culross.

Nearly all charming places everywhere in the world have been converted --or are in process of conversion-- to dormitories of the rich. That is because it is almost everywhere illegal to build places with the characteristics rich folks (and the rest of us) find charming.

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[Alonzo-ny]

I didnt really explore fife, even though i went to college in dundee just over the Tay from the Kingdom of Fife as its called, i have been to st. andrews many times though. I hate the fife accent along with the dundee accent, although i cant say much for the east glasgow accent i have pretty much erradicted from my speech now thankfully! Did you visit Scotland or is this village something you discovered some other way?

[matteofi]

I help you!
The second place is in Tuscany!

[lofter1]

Culross.

Nearly all charming places everywhere in the world have been converted --or are in process of conversion-- to dormitories of the rich.

Which can make travel somewhat depressing -- and really tough on the pocket book.

[Fabrizio]

Unfortunately an influx of wealthy residents is the only way that many of these places can survive and be kept from crumbling.

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And here's a small city... completely surrounded by a wall. Lucca Italy. I know these parts very well....


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[czsz]

Unfortunately an influx of wealthy residents is the only way that many of these places can survive and be kept from crumbling.

I don't know...there are thousand-year-old monasteries that aren't exactly falling apart without some London stockbrokers turning them into summer homes.

[Luca]

Instead of whingeing about "London stockbrokers" maybe the rest of the world shoudl concentrate on the entirely possible (if currently 'illegal' as Ablarc points out) construction of decent new places as opposed to the dreck that gets built.

[ablarc]

Nearly all charming places everywhere in the world have been converted --or are in process of conversion-- to dormitories of the rich. That is because it is almost everywhere illegal to build places with the characteristics rich folks (and the rest of us) find charming.


Unfortunately an influx of wealthy residents is the only way that many of these places can survive and be kept from crumbling.
Respectfully, Fabrizio: you’re dead wrong about this. In your country, all those charming places survived the depredations of relative postwar poverty stretching back centuries and encompassing wars. These places survive because folks live in them --whether rich or poor.

The rich have recently taken over all charming places because:

A. There are more rich people today; those rich people have more disposable income to spend on quaint pieds-a-terre. Like you, they want to impress their friends with their neat digs, and they want to enjoy the beauty themselves.

B. No increase in supply: Culross and Monteriggioni can’t legally be produced today; they violate zoning codes in force everywhere --probably even in the very regions where they were built. Unless zoning is changed we’ll never again see their ilk. AND YET they’re completely livable today in spite of zoning’s theories to the contrary; the rich folks who pay top dollar are testament to that. If developers were allowed to build such places, they would continue to sell out profitably until demand was saturated and prices came down.

C. Rich folks with big bucks provide financial inducement to locals to sell out and move to the suburbs.

The very same thing is happening in the U.S. Tired of sitting in traffic jams and living in humdrum suburbia, folks are moving back to run-down but architecturally-charming “inner city” neighborhoods. I design their houses and renovations.


I don't know...there are thousand-year-old monasteries that aren't exactly falling apart without some London stockbrokers turning them into summer homes.
Built to last, whether occupied by rich or poor.


Instead of whingeing about "London stockbrokers" maybe the rest of the world shoudl concentrate on the entirely possible (if currently 'illegal' as Ablarc points out) construction of decent new places as opposed to the dreck that gets built.
Right on.

First step: zoning revised to make sense.

[GVNY]

Ablarc, could you draft a faux zoning plan that would allow for the construction of beautiful places for us who don't necessarily know how to go about getting that done, or what it would actually say?

[Fabrizio]

"Unfortunately an influx of wealthy residents is the only way that many of these places can survive and be kept from crumbling."

Ablarc: some things for you to consider: in my town, as in so many others, many many buildings are simply not up to modern living standards. To renovate the buildings and sell the apartments costs a fortune. There are also European standards now that buildings must adhere to also, and it also costs money. You must also realize that a town like mine is under strict landmarking... again, renovation costs are a fortune.

Who can afford to keep those quaint buildings looking quaint but up to standards with proper plumbing, wiring, heating and roofs that don't leak?

Certainly not the average family. Do you have any idea of what average salaries are like here?

Also: You are not considering that an Italian today has different expectations... a different lifestyle than 50 years ago. You want lots of heat in the winter, no drafts, you want an electrical system that will support a dishwasher and a dryer running at the same time, you want to be close to work, you want PARKING that's fee and close to your home (you most likely have 2 cars) , or maybe you want to be close to the train, you want to be near good schools. Life is just set up differently today.

So what do you do? you move out to the out side of town into a new townhouse condominium-block... and leave the hassle and primitive living conditions to the wealthy. No young Italian family on an average workers salary would ever consider moving to Monteriggioni. Why? For what reason?

The building that I live in, believe me, in 2007, can ONLY be lived in by people with means. Who else could pay my heating bill?

The funny thing is that my building STARTED OUT as a home for the nobility, in ancient times the town centers etc were NOT for the peasants but for higher class. Even those serving the gentry were of a higher social status. Today the building is divided into apartments, own by well-to-do Italians (most with second homes in the country or the sea). So after it's renovation and new tenants, it is actually closer to it's original purpose today than years ago.

BTW: why do you think Monteriggioni was sorrounded by a wall? And on a hilltop? The wealthy protecting their riches.

Oh, those gated communities.

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[ZippyTheChimp]

Industrial Revolution.

Instead of maximizing profits by keeping wages low, produce more and sell to the workers.

Discretionary Income available to the masses.

High labor costs.

It may have made replicating those homes very expensive, but it allowed so many of us to discuss it on the internet.

[ablarc]

Ablarc, could you draft a faux zoning plan that would allow for the construction of beautiful places for us who don't necessarily know how to go about getting that done, or what it would actually say?
Temporarily suspend zoning altogether in selected areas that could benefit from that action. When and if problems emerge, address those problems narrowly.

Zoning in my jurisdiction covers over 1000 pages of dense print. The sages who concocted it pontificate knowingly about setbacks, buffers, fence heights, land use, sidewalk widths, building heights et al. –exactly as though they possessed the immutable wisdom to grave those commands in the stone of law. In fact no one –least of all these days—possesses the understanding to make such edicts.

Houston is often cited as an example of the evils of not having zoning, and Houston is a pretty awful place. But Charlotte is awful too, and so is Memphis, and so is Raleigh –and these all have zoning aplenty. In fact, I daresay you can’t tell the difference between Houston and Charlotte on a casual visit. A conclusion you can draw: zoning really doesn’t justify the enormous hardship and financial loss with which it burdens the property owner.

What planning wisdom would emerge from temporarily suspending zoning altogether? In Houston, nothing; no one expects the folks in Houston to be out there on the cutting edge of innovation; they mostly replicate what they find elsewhere.

Greenfield and brownfield developments, however, would show an immediate spike in creativity and experimentation as developers and their architects sought and found new and more profitable development patterns. Most of these would inevitably involve higher densities combined with greater market appeal. It might usher in a period of breathtaking innovation.

Cobwebs swept away. Who knows: someone might even build a Monteriggioni.


"Unfortunately an influx of wealthy residents is the only way that many of these places can survive and be kept from crumbling."

Ablarc: some things for you to consider: in my town, as in so many others, many many buildings are simply not up to modern living standards. To renovate the buildings and sell the apartments costs a fortune. There are also European standards now that buildings must adhere to also, and it also costs money.
Regulation creating problems again. What are these exalted “European standards”?


So what do you do? you move out to the out side of town into a new townhouse condominium-block... and leave the hassle and primitive living conditions to the wealthy. No young Italian family on an average workers salary would ever consider moving to Monteriggioni…

The building that I live in, believe me, in 2007, can ONLY be lived in by people with means. Who else could pay my heating bill?
Point taken.